Builder Chris, in the UK, is working his way through the process in getting his Midlana road-legal. Here’s a short video of him backing his car out of the garage after successfully completing the MOT testing! Great job, Chris, and the car looks fantastic!
Readers of the Midlana Forum are regularly kept up to date on the near constant discounts available for the Midlana book. This week, the publisher sprung a big 30% discount on us, good through 30 November only. If you’re looking to get the book, either for yourself or as a gift, this is as good a discount as they ever give, so best to jump on it quick.
If you miss out, they typically repeat the 30% discount again before Christmas, but normally it’s less. Go to the publisher, Lulu, and search for “Midlana.” It’s available in both regular and coil-bound binding.
There is another!
Builder Chris of Worcestershire UK has completed the first Midlana besides my own, with just IVA testing being the last hurdle before having it fully road-legal. I asked Chris to provide some information about himself, his previous car knowledge, and his Alfa Romeo V6-powered Midlana build:
“I intended Midlana to be a retirement project, although I did do a few small jobs before retiring like sourcing a couple of donor vehicles and preparing the donor parts.”
Chris was a broadcast engineer for most of his working life, and has always been interested in cars as a lad, “doing a bit of backstreet apprenticeship with a neighbor.”
Chris’s previous car experience: “Started messing with production cars, mostly Fiats and Lancias, first kit car was a very poor quality Cobra copy and almost at the same time, a Westfield for my partner Vickie, who wanted something nippy and easy to park. The Cobra was pretty enough but the chassis and suspension was fundamentally flawed and I got rid of it as soon as I could. Next non-production car was a Marcos Mantula Spyder, which was bought used. It was a bit tired, so I did a few mods/improvements to it then decided it needed a bit more work so stripped it down completely, removed the live rear axle and replaced it with a cut-down Jaguar IRS setup and re-designed the front suspension to cure criminally bad bump steer.
Next was the Lancia Stratos replica. This was a basket case of very much-abused 4th-hand bits. Most of the chassis (previous owner had cut the roof structure off for some reason), no suspension parts, some of the body moldings plus a huge pile of assorted junk – almost a garage clearance. Took me a while, but I got there in the end and some people whose opinion I value (and who know of what they speak) said it was a nice car.”
Build time for Midlana: About 40 months. “During the build, I’d say I spent about 20 hours a week during the milder months. Very little time over the winter and until I fitted air conditioning to the shed, not in summer either! I’ve no clue as to how many hours I have spent actually building – lots.”
“I really enjoyed most of the build process. I was introduced to being independent with my last project, it being in such a poor state when I got it, and the company that made the kit was just in the process of folding up so I was very lucky to grab a few vital parts before they went for good. I’d have been really stuck if I’d not been able to get the missing body parts I think. The rest, not so bad. The modifications I did to the Marcos were also good practice for Midlana.”
“The part I found least enjoyable was the panel work – not something I’ve really had to do before and due to lack of space, at times it was pretty tedious but it’s generally come out OK and I’ve begun to learn some new skills, or at least the basics of them.”
Overall comments: “Without the Midlana book, I never would have contemplated a build like this. Of course I’ve been aware of the ‘Locost’/DIY build field but it was never something I’d have ventured into. A complete scratch build of my own design never appealed for a range of reasons, not least being it looked like far too much work! Given your previous build and that Midlana just appealed to me visually at first, then ‘mechanically’ as I learned more about it, I found myself entertaining the idea. I’m honestly not sure how I’d feel about building a kit now. I might find it a bit dull!”
Congratulations Chris! You can find his complete build diary here.
Our parent’s house sold, so the weekends have opened back up somewhat. I say “somewhat” because there are always honey-dos, but that still leaves some me-time, so Midlana was taken out for the first time in about six months(!) Everything was fine, until the engine was found to rev limit right at 4,000 rpm, so it was very likely happening by design… (always be suspicious of round numbers). Glancing at the sensor values showed that lambda (air-fuel ratio) was reading “1.oo” (another suspicious round number), which is fine, except that it wasn’t changing. I expected to find that I’d forgotten to reinstall the sensor. I panicked for a second when the sensor was found installed, but then discovered that I’d committed a cardinal sin: installing the sensor but failed to latch the connector. No harm done, but it’s a reminder to not make that a habit!
In other news, Tesla just came out with their Plaid Model S (no kidding). What’s notable about this $140,000 sedan that can carry 4-5 adults is that it has around 1,100 hp. But what’s probably a historic milestone is that you can expect to be barred from many drag strips because it doesn’t have a cage or parachute, items required for 8-second cars, which is what Tesla claims it can achieve.
Drivetrain technology aside, I’m not sure that people spending $140K want something that looks the same as the 10-yr old $60K version. And even more importantly, as impressive as its 1:30 Laguna Seca lap time is, it weighs 4,500 lbs! That’s seriously heavy for a “sports car” of any sort, and all that weight/energy has to be dealt with via the brakes and tires. The brake solution is straightforward: go huge. For the tires though, they’re going to be a very high wear item if anyone takes it to a track day event. That said, tire expense seems to be ignored these days, and I guess if you can afford a $140,000 car, tire cost isn’t a thing. In any case, it seems like we’re very near the point where electric sports cars take over as far as performance goes; all it takes now are lighter batteries to seal the deal. Notice that battery range wasn’t mentioned. The above car has a 500 mile range, so limited range is no longer a reason not to buy one (cost aside of course).
I was looking through the archives and was surprised to see that 10 years ago, Midlana was already complete enough that it was first tuned at the dyno shop. In other news, my brother was set to do the Virginia City Hillclimb again this year but it got cancelled, so he decided instead to get married, hah.
We finally finished cleaning out our parent’s house and it’s now up for sale, so maybe I get back some of my weekend, which has me thinking about what project to do next, but I’m sort of going in circles. As was written earlier, the idea was putting a fiberglass 1930’s coupe body on a late model Corvette. That thinking is confronted with several issues: it’s not anything new or unusual (but, do I care?); I don’t have enough space due to the sheer volume of the parts; I currently want to keep Midlana, which is occupying the build space; because Midlana is being kept, its value isn’t available to fund the next project.
Then there’s wondering whether I should consider going electric, but that means sinking $$$$ (or even $$$$$) into just the drivetrain. There’s a ton of old Priuses (“Pre-eye”?) out there, potentially cheap donors for a play car. The thing is that I don’t want to deal with hybrids due to them having two systems instead of just one—I’d either stay gas or go all-electric. Once it’s finished, it’s essentially a rebodied Prius/Volt/Bolt/Tesla, which, okay, I guess. And then there’s not knowing how much weight can be stripped out of such a thing, A Tesla Model 3 is around 4,000 lbs, so giving it the light shell and tube frame treatment might bring it down to what, 2,500-3,000 lbs? But then it’s essentially an electric Midlana. Since I already have Midlana, I don’t feel very motivated to convert it over because the driveline (motor and battery pack) needs to be designed around from the start. It would be a lot easier for a new Midlana builder to put such a driveline on his build table and go from there. Anyway, for me, I’d like something with more creature comforts, hence me going round in circles, hah.
As I type this, it’s 106° F and is right on schedule, being the first week of September. Before it got really unpleasant this morning, I cleaned out the rat-poop infested workshop at my parent’s house, which finishes the worst part of the job. The house and garage are now about 98% cleaned out, so attention is turning toward making the yard a bit nicer before the house goes up for sale.
It’s a sad but necessary part of life, cleaning out your parent’s home, but so it goes. We’ve had several Zoom meetings with mom, her at the retirement home and us calling from her house. She’s both hard of hearing and has trouble processing sounds even when she does hear them, and between that and the typical laptop speakers, it’s not much of a meeting. She seems happy with the place, but did ask why she was there and when she could come home, and that’s when the feelings of guilt and deceit arise, but there wasn’t any choice in the matter. Anyway, seeing us seems to make her happy, and that’s the whole point.
(It finally dropped below 100° F just before 6PM)
While I’d like to be driving Midlana, we’re busy cleaning out our parent’s house, hence the truck. The task that we were all putting off was cleaning out the workshop and behind the garage due to the huge amount of rat droppings. I decided to first spray it with a very fine mist of water to settle the dust, then blast it out with a strong water jet. Bleach was considered, but it leaves a very strong lingering smell, and we hope to sell the house sooner rather than later. Also, since both the workshop and rear of the garage are nearly fully enclosed, the bleach smell would remain trapped, so that was off the list.
The foul stuff completely filled a wheel barrow—it was bad. I dispatched four out of six mice that darted out as I lifted one of the million boxes, and two rat parents ran off, leaving a crying baby. I did not enjoy that but it had to be done. The rear of the garage is done, and the floor in the workshop, but with my brother being off enjoying a track day at Laguna Seca instead of helping out, means that he gets to deal with the workshop shelves, which has its own share of squeaking noises, scurrying feet, and droppings everywhere.
Next week I’m on-call, and between that and this, I feel like I’ve lost control of my weekends. I know that “this, too, shall pass”, but I look forward to returning to my own garage to piddle about, perhaps after this first heatwave of the year has run its course.
Since moving mom to the retirement home, we’ve had two Web meetings with the place. The first took place one day after she moved in, and they said “Oh yes, she’s fitting right in, eating well, and making lots of new friends!” They included a few pictures of her, but suspiciously, her face wasn’t visible in any of them. In other words, we suspected we were hearing BS.
The second meeting was two days later and included her doctor, us, mom. and a representative from the home. At one point in the conversation, the doctor asked the home “how was her first night?” There was a pause just long enough that us kids glanced at each other, then the representative said “Yeah the first night was pretty rough.” Okay then…
I’m posting this so that when the time comes in your family, you can expect similar interactions with these places, businesses that are nearly or completely opaque. You only have their word about what’s going on inside, and especially in these cases, we can’t really believe anything mom says (it’s to that point now), so if she says they’re mistreating her, are they? How can we know? Due to privacy laws, such places don’t allow external video feeds, so we’re left in the dark. I joked that when we call, we should expect to hear, “Your relative is doing great… what’s their name?”
Sigh, a big day, just not the kind you ever want to have.
Mom’s physical and mental health has slowly been degrading over the last few years. We did the best we could, first taking care of her ourselves via welfare checks a few times a week (she’s still living in the same house that we grew up in.) After that became insufficient, we shared time with a caregiver, but it came to a point that “it was time.” She sees things that aren’t there, accuses people of things that didn’t happen, says that people are stealing from her (she moves things and forgets), and that strange people are visiting, and it just all painted a picture of where things were heading. We installed security cameras, which of course showed nothing, and suspect that at that stage of life, dreams and reality get mixed together. She also started having angry outbursts, which are easier to understand when viewed from her point of view: people saying things that don’t make sense, things that you absolutely “know for fact” that are wrong. Even so, things couldn’t be allowed keep degrading. When she told the caregiver “you must go home because it’s dark”, in the middle of a sunny day, we know that it was time.
And so, we lied, getting her in the car to go for a “drive to see a garden”, walking her to the front door of the rest home—like walking a friend to the gallows, it just feels very deceitful, and yet, it had to be done. Probably the saddest aspect of this is knowing that with her mix of being hard of hearing, having trouble processing sounds into words even when she does hear them, and being delusional, she’s going to have a difficult or even impossible time carrying on even simple conversations. We worry that she may retreat inward and just shut down.
Or maybe we’ll be completely wrong and she’ll quickly fit in. Uh huh.
That said, we’re extremely fortunate to be able to afford moving her to a rest home. I’m very aware that many people cannot and try to take care of their relative while still holding down a job. As tough as this is emotionally, it could be far worse.
Like I said when dad died, “I accept what’s happening but don’t have to like it.” And yes, the little voice in my head did ask, “so with both of your parents becoming delusional, what do you think that means for you?”
With Midlana builders starting to complete their car’s bodywork, it reminds me that I need to update my blog. Background: This whole odyssey regarding the rear panel started after I damaged it and never got around to really fixing it. Instead, the area was used to add a diffuser and and to both extend the exhaust and add a muffler. So the area was being used, but nothing was done to improve the car’s look from the rear.
After a lot of thinking, the diffuser is being removed. Why? While they can work well—on a proper car—it looks odd and out of place on Midlana. Its value at anything less than track speeds is questionable (other than getting street ‘cred, hah). Its effectiveness isn’t helped by the fairly high 4″ ground clearance. (That said, the pictures of the removed diffuser do show the expected and desired flow, so it was doing something. One disappointment was that driving down a street with leaves on it, they never did jump off the street into the air.
Removing the diffuser shortens the car by about two feet, valuable garage space that I wanted back. I still like the original solid panel the best aesthetically, but I’m going with wire mesh to aid engine compartment ventilation. If you’ve ever dealt with woven wire, it’s much like cloth, where the edges can fray and fall out during cutting and installation. Having the wires welded makes the panel much easier to deal with. The one down side is that welded-wire mesh isn’t available in many sizes, with the largest wire being 0.03″, (0.7mm). I’d rather it be thicker for stiffness and looks, but oh well.
Also in the same area is the exhaust and muffler. The child in me misses the turbo whistle sound, so the muffler is coming off, reverting back to using only the turbo as the muffler (as the Dodge SRT-4 does, so I read). This cleans up the engine compartment, moves the pieces out of the way, gets rid of about 4 feet of heat-radiating tubing, and about 15 pounds from the worst location possible, aft of rear axle center line.
Lastly, I’ve been meaning to back off on spring rate. As it is now, it’s right on the edge of being too harsh for the street, So the rear springs were reduced from 600 lb/in to 400 lb/in, and the fronts reduced from 300 lb/in to 250. You may notice they aren’t being reduced by the same percentage. The front is being reduced less to ensure that any oversteer tendency is held in check, and because I didn’t have any 200 lb/in springs! The original reason for going stiffer was to make ensure that the rear suspension never bottomed out, but I don’t think that it did. Yeah, maybe I’m getting soft in my old age, or just being more realistic about what the car is and isn’t.
Back to the screen material for a second, which is stainless and currently unpainted. I haven’t decided whether to leave it as-is or paint it black. I think a solid panel looks better, and painting it black may make it sort of disappear, causing the car to again look like its back end is open. We’ll see.
And another Midlana engine start, this time with an Alfa V6 no less!
Happy Fourth to everyone, and as part of the celebration, I’m happy to announce that Bryan is the first builder to reach the engine-start phase of his project, https://youtu.be/5INEWZDfYGc
Bryan chose an SRT-4 turbo drivetrain for its availability, aftermarket support, and affordability. Congratulations! Bryan’s entire build thread is one of the growing list on the Midlana Builders’ Forum
Though I haven’t been posting here much, things are happening on the Midlana Builders’ Forum. There’s is growing excitement as several builders are reaching major milestones, including getting their cars on its wheels, first engine start, and the beginning of final assembly. So if you’d like, wander over and take a look at the build logs to share in the fun!
I’m still here, no virus, though I did have a nasty 24-hr flu that shares many symptoms. Just been working from home, and with the 1.5 hours saved everyday from commuting, the time’s been spent getting the 16″ f/4.3 telescope done, and it nearly is.
The design is commonly called a “hexapod”, and consists of six tubes assembled into three truss assemblies 120° apart. There are several reasons to go this way over the more traditional 4-truss 8-tube design:
1. The telescope is collimated (aligned) solely by adjusting tube length. The tube assemblies are just like the toe control links in Midlana, with each using a left and right-hand rod end to set its length. What’s interesting is, once fully assembled, turning just the upper ends of the truss ends adjusts the upper assembly tilt, and turning just the lower ends adjust its location relative to the main mirror.
2. #1 means that the main mirror cell and secondary holder do not have to be adjustable, which lowers weight, increase stiffness, reduces cost, and make the assemblies simpler—sound familiar?
3. To some extent, focusing range can be adjusted by altering the upper-to-lower assembly distance.
The last point has consumed the most time. Every primary mirror has a unique focal length, this one is 68.7″. This means that from the main mirror, to the secondary diagonal mirror, and out to the focuser has to be 68.7″ inches, sort of. The catch is that the value gets modified if a “coma corrector” lens is present. Anyway, if it ends up being wrong (outside the range of the focuser’s travel limits), the strut tube lengths can be adjusted if it’s slight, or different length threaded Delrin tube inserts may become necessary. I started with one set and found that focus was off by about 2″, so a second set was made that was 2″ longer. What’s left me scratching my head is that it didn’t correct the situation by the expected 2″. The catch is that I may or may not have had the coma corrector in place, and probably didn’t use the same eyepiece. That’s another issue, that different types and brands of eyepieces all have different focal points. This means that before the scope can really be considered finished, all the eyepieces have to be checked to confirm whether they all come to focus… and one eyepiece (one said to have a strong focus offset) is currently back ordered.
In the meantime, servo drivers for tracking start targets are being installed. Some people consider such a thing a waste, but I find it annoying having a planet or star under high magnification drift fast from the field of view, and then the scope is pushed to follow it, only to then lose it. Anyway, that system will take a bit to learn.
Even with composite construction for the upper assembly, carbon tubes, and low-profile lower assembly, the overall assembly is around 65 lbs, enough that I don’t want to carry it, so wheels and handles are being added as well. After it’s fully operational and checked out, it all has to come apart for paint. While part of me would like a furniture-grade varnish-like finish, nope, paint it will be. I don’t want to deal with the time, mess, and smell that beautiful wood finishes entail, especially all the sanding. Been there done that with Kimini, no more sanding!
The little voice in my head did ask though, “A scope, that’s nice, so how does someone who has to be in bed by 9:30-10pm in order to get up at 5am for work planning to spend hours out under the stars?” Good question, but this project and other going-ons in the garage are about planning ahead about how I’ll spend my time in retirement, someday. Anyway, through dumb luck, it turns out that Mars is going to be the closest in its orbit to Earth this Fall, so I’m really looking forward to that.
I’m still here but haven’t been working on Midlana. Builders, on the other hand, are pushing ahead on their builds, and you can check that out on the Midlana forum. Locally, car events keep getting cancelled, and who knows when we’ll start risking ourselves in the name of fun again. Here in Southern California, activity and travel restrictions have lessened slightly, but it seems almost certain that by the end of all this, we’ll have all been exposed to the virus, it’s just a matter of when.
Our American culture is such that we sometimes don’t like being told what to do, and often involves mention of freedom and Constitutional rights. What protesters (including anti-vaxers!) don’t understand however, is that we’re dealing with a virus that simply doesn’t care. Wanting things to go back to normal is understandable, but that’s in conflict with a virus that only cares about finding its next host. What bothers me most is how some people figure that because they’re young and don’t have symptoms (and even if they do), what do they care? Wow.
On the other hand, the damage to the economy is dire, and I heard a pretty good analogy that went something like: “We currently have a speed limit on most freeways of 65 mph, but we could save a lot more lives if we lowered it to 20 mph.” The reality is that there’s a balance between lives lost and the economy. If you ask the protesters, we passed that point long ago. On the other hand, if you ask a mom how much should be spent treating her critically-ill child, she’ll say whatever it takes. Where the balancing point?
Anyway, I’m fortunate to be able to work from home, which has brought to light a new situation, where it’s sort of like being retired, but not. That is, everyday feels very much like the day before, and sometimes I have to remind myself what day of the week it is. Midi, our dog, is confused because he sees me sitting for hours staring at a laptop, when I should obviously be giving him walks or tummy rubs. He’s getting old and has really slowed down lately, not helped by him hurting his foot while running around barking at the increased number of people walking by. He’s sleeping a lot more recently, to the point that sometimes I watch him to see if he’s still breathing. Yeah, I fear that he’s getting close to the end of his adventure, and I really don’t like to think about that.
To end on some positive news, I am working in the garage, just not on the car. The new workbench has been put to good use, supporting construction of the new telescope that’s been in the works for a couple years now. In other news, the wooden gear clock project has been shelved, as cutting the gears and finishing the teeth is more work than I want to do. A CNC router was tried, but even it left a lot of chipped and frayed plywood. What I’d really like is to have it cut via laser, but the only place that returned a quote wanted $600. So, it sits.
Between working from home, light but long term rain, and the virus, Midlana is safe in the garage on a trickle charger. If you’ve ever driven an open wheel car in the wet, well, you’re missing out. Perhaps you remember riding a bike without fenders through a puddle, and the sudden realization that you now have a muddy racing strip down the middle of your back. Only takes once to learn that lesson. As far as driving in the wet, anything off straight-ahead results in a shower, and even after the car is dried off with a towel, everything that can rust, does.
When weather allows, work continues in the backyard, replacing our 25+ year-old railroad ties with retaining blocks. When it’s rainy, I’m in the garage working on the new telescope 🙂
It’s surprising to see an uptick in book sales. Maybe it’s due to people stuck at home looking for something to read, but I’m also hoping that it might be that people have the attitude that “this, too, shall pass”, and are considering building a fun car. Glad that I can help!
Attempted to contact another hot rod company through their web page and heard nothing. Found an email address and tried again; it came back as a bad address—sigh, here we go again. Called their number and got an answering machine, no reply yet. Maybe they’re on vacation, maybe they’re busy, but the more time that elapses puts doubt into the minds of potential customers as to whether they’re a good place to be sending money to. Good to find this out upfront. Before I’d started contacting hot rod companies, for some reason I expected them to be more reliable and responsive than kit car companies. Now I wonder why I thought there’d be any difference. Regardless, there’s no timeline for this project, so there’s time to mull over sources, project goals, and the budget.
In other news, I can tell that people are staying home, not just due to how many people are out walking, more cars in driveways, but the rust on brake discs from disuse. It also seems like air quality has improved and visibility is better, which says something about us mucking with things.
Project thoughts continue. One contender is the Chevy 3100 pickup truck, for no other reason that it looks okay and is available. Authentic steel ones are still around, but they, like most old trucks, are utilitarian vehicles with very upright seating and short cabs. Hot rodders demanded more leg room so it’s common that aftermarket fiberglass shells are about 6″ longer than stock. Also, the cab is typically chopped (the roof lowered) about 4-6″ for looks. Price wise, a very used steel 3100 is a fair bit cheaper than a fiberglass shell, and you get “everything” (much of which is useless to me), but they also have all the expected issues that go with a 70-year old vehicle. The question is, is starting with that better or worse than starting with a fiberglass shell?
That said, I haven’t really made a final decision on the overall envelope, so letting the issue sit for a while usually helps focus in on a solution.
Contacted a couple more hot rod shops and they’ve been more responsive. While doing so is a bit premature, it’s necessary to see whose out there and still in business. Some are a little sketchy, with websites looking like they were made 25 years ago (you know the ones: varying text sizes and fonts, flashing text, a total pallet of only eight colors, dead product links, etc). I suppose that could be spun to mean that they’ve been around a long time and haven’t updated their site, but when there’s no contact info other than a phone number, it makes one wonder.
Typing out loud, some time is needed to let this stew. The concern is whether I’d be okay with a cookie-cutter hot rod, regardless of performance. I’m not sure. On the one hand, I like to pretend that I don’t care. On the other hand, I’m not sure that I’ll be happy doing anything other than going my own way. What’s testing that creativity is having a weather-tight cab as a top requirement, which for me means starting with something preexisting (don’t get me started on dealing with doors and weatherstripping, see the Kimini blog for that). Technically I could start with a metal truck cab and go from there—modifying composite is undesirable for many reasons listed elsewhere. I have a couple design ideas about how I want it to look, but am I prepared for the years of work to do a full custom project again?
There are other factors too, such as whether the windshield is flat or curved. If the car is used on-track, the windshield is going to get pitted and cracked fairly quickly. If the glass is flat, it’s easy to have another made up. If it’s some old oddball OEM curved glass, there’s always the possibility of hearing “sorry, those aren’t available anymore” (and then what do you do?). One negative regarding flat windshields is that, depending upon angle, it can reflect whatever the driver’s wearing. This may not seem like a big deal until you’re driving into the sun and wearing a white shirt! (Midlana’s flat windscreen doesn’t have this problem because it’s angled back at a steep 45°.)
Speaking of oddball, I learned of a car I’d never heard of before, a Henry J, which was an economy car sold in the US in the early 1950s. It’s quirky and unusual enough to get my attention, but with a 100″ wheelbase (Corvette is 106″), it means shortening the torque tube, something I want to avoid if possible. Overall length is 178″, oddly close to the 15-ft length that keeps popping up.
My garage has a vertical clearance of 8-ft. If final ground clearance of the car is 4″, and the shell is (total guess) 48″ tall, then that leaves 96 – 48 – 4 – 2 (chassis tubing), for a working space between the two of 42″. Not great, but probably workable. There could be an issue as the roll cage is fabricated because it’ll extend up into the shell even with it up against the rafters. Whether that becomes a problem at some point needs some thought. The point of bringing this up is that a multi-piece shell is both a help and a hindrance, as in, where are they stored? Starting with just the passenger compartment (like a truck… again) keeps the clutter down. It does mean potentially paying a shipping fee twice if the nose is decided on later, though as discussed earlier, it’s highly likely that where I’d place the cab wouldn’t be where the manufacturer intended.
Anyway, around and around the process goes!